Why a life raft on a rib?

[gingercoastie]

This is from my own personnel recolection and not any official MCA statistics or records.


During the fastnet race that was hit by a storm and a number of sailors lost thier lives. The majority of fatalities were from people in liferafts who had abondoned thier boat prematurely. Most boats were found and recovered after the storm and though they were damaged they had managed to stay alfloat even though their crew had abandoned.

Moral: your yacht/ship/rib is the best liferaft you have got, do not be so keen to abandon it to a overgrown lilo with a roof.

I reiterate that these are my oprinions and not the MCA's

[John Kennett]

Originally Posted by gingercoastie

Moral: your yacht/ship/rib is the best liferaft you have got, do not be so keen to abandon it to a overgrown lilo with a roof.

It's definately a last resort, and not a decision to be taken lightly. The advice I was given on a sea survival course was that you should step UP from your boat onto the life raft!

John

[spectre racing]

Have you ever thought how many people work in those liferaft repair and service centres and how much of tax payers money goes on keeping those bean counters in the MCA in a job!

Liferaft on a rib is a complete waste of time but socialism always comes at a cost!

[Rogue Wave]

So do you have them on your charter boats

[Stephen-RIB]

Originally Posted by spectre racing

Have you ever thought how many people work in those liferaft repair and service centres and how much of tax payers money goes on keeping those bean counters in the MCA in a job!

Liferaft on a rib is a complete waste of time but socialism always comes at a cost!

You are talking absolute tosh! There are many good reasons to carry a liferaft on a RIB as I think Alan Priddy and his guys will tell you.

What about Fire, collision with a large object, capsize or flipping. All of these can happen inshore and offshore and carrying a liferaft would be prudent if it can be afforded by the user.

[Stephen-RIB]

Originally Posted by gingercoastie

This is from my own personnel recolection and not any official MCA statistics or records.


During the fastnet race that was hit by a storm and a number of sailors lost thier lives. The majority of fatalities were from people in liferafts who had abondoned thier boat prematurely. Most boats were found and recovered after the storm and though they were damaged they had managed to stay alfloat even though their crew had abandoned.

Moral: your yacht/ship/rib is the best liferaft you have got, do not be so keen to abandon it to a overgrown lilo with a roof.

I reiterate that these are my oprinions and not the MCA's

I agree with the not leaving your boat until absolutely necessary. However liferafts have come a long way since the fastnet some twenty five years ago. Much larger ballast pockets, sea anchors, beacons, boarding ladders, better stability. Also there is much better training available and in the case of the Fastnet race most of the crew have to have logged a certain amount of offshore racing miles before taking part and also complete a sea survival course.

[Scary Des]

Originally Posted by Stephen-RIB

........ However liferafts have come a long way since the fastnet some twenty five years ago...........

Three of the people killed on the 98 Sidney-Hobart race were ‘washed out’ of their liferaft which strikes me as a bit of a design fault, so I am not sure that liferafts have really come a long way I think that they are a last resort that offers slightly improved odds over jumping into the sea with a life jacket on
Des

[Stephen-RIB]

Originally Posted by Scary Des

Three of the people killed on the 98 Sidney-Hobart race were ‘washed out’ of their liferaft which strikes me as a bit of a design fault, so I am not sure that liferafts have really come a long way I think that they are a last resort that offers slightly improved odds over jumping into the sea with a life jacket on
Des

That strom was described as a Bomb, we lost a member of our sailing club in that race and he was tethered to the yacht he was skippering at the time. The use of a liferaft would still be essentail in case of fire, sinking etc. There could be othyer circumstances about how those people where washed out fo the raft, was the liferaft fully manned for instance? if it was a 6 man raft with only three persons in it then its not suprising that they where washed from it as it would not have been fully loaded. Anyway, thats just one example. Having serviced liferafts professionally I can tell you that the design has come a long way from the rafts available 25 years ago!

[Scary Des]

The owner of the Winston Churchill criticised the life rafts for poor design and inadequate strength, they had two rafts on board one 4 man with 4 men in and on 6 man this 5 in. After the boat sank they entered the life rafts and deployed the drogues which failed by ripping off the d rings and damaging the raft. Both rafts were capsizes during the night.
Comparing lift rafts to car safety improvements in the last 25 yours the lift raft has not really changed that much. Des

[Stephen-RIB]

Originally Posted by Scary Des

The owner of the Winston Churchill criticised the life rafts for poor design and inadequate strength, they had two rafts on board one 4 man with 4 men in and on 6 man this 5 in. After the boat sank they entered the life rafts and deployed the drogues which failed by ripping off the d rings and damaging the raft. Both rafts were capsizes during the night.
Comparing lift rafts to car safety improvements in the last 25 yours the lift raft has not really changed that much. Des

Well, that might be the case in that occasion, but do we know how old the rafts were, when they were last serviced, were they stored properly, what make they were?

[Scary Des]

Originally Posted by Stephen-RIB

Well, that might be the case in that occasion, but do we know how old the rafts were, when they were last serviced, were they stored properly, what make they were?

Both in Service made by RFD or something, they are an Australian company. des

[spectre racing]

Originally Posted by Stephen-RIB

You are talking absolute tosh! There are many good reasons to carry a liferaft on a RIB as I think Alan Priddy and his guys will tell you.

What about Fire, collision with a large object, capsize or flipping. All of these can happen inshore and offshore and carrying a liferaft would be prudent if it can be afforded by the user.

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I accept maybe for Syndney Hobart rib races or fastnet rib races a liferaft might be a comfort but for 99.9% of the ribbing population who likes to burn around the Solent a liferaft is a waste of deckspace and a hazard.

The fact that the defence is coming for a liferaft salesman proves the point.

[Stephen-RIB]

Originally Posted by spectre racing

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I accept maybe for Syndney Hobart rib races or fastnet rib races a liferaft might be a comfort but for 99.9% of the ribbing population who likes to burn around the Solent a liferaft is a waste of deckspace and a hazard.

The fact that the defence is coming for a liferaft salesman proves the point.

Who says a liferaft must be deck mounted? If you like to burn up and down the Solent you are probably more likely to have a collision. The water is not always that warm and if you did have to abandon boat I know exactly where I would prefer to be whilst I waited for the RNLI or India Juliet..... In a nice warm liferaft wrapped up in a TPA.

I agree that a liferaft might not be so useful on a boat buzzing up and down the Solent if space is limited but a small 4 man raft in a valise takes up no more room than your cool box packed with all your beer, in an emergency such as a fire it would be a useful item to have. There are quite a few members on this forum who cruise a lot further afield than the Solent and to make stupid generalisations about it being some money making scam for the MCA is just plain stupid and makes you sound like you are trolling.

The fact that I sell liferafts has nothing to do with my opinion on here - I sell a handful each year and its no big money earner for me. I have been sailing since I was 7 years old. I have been driving Rigid Inflatable Boats professionally and for pleasure for about 14 years. I sail thousands of sea miles each year on all sorts of boats professionally and for fun, I write in-depth sailing news and have done for many years and I am also fully trained in boat repair, plus I used to service rafts for Messenger Marine before they sold out so I think I have some experience on the subject of the suitability of liferafts for boats and its not my commercial head speaking. But since you have given me the idea if anyone wants a raft there is a discount for RIBnet members!

The fact that you only joined this forum a couple of days ago and spouted of some tosh about it being a socialist scam doesnt help your argument.

[Nick Hearne]

Stephen do you realize who it is?
http://www.rib.net/forum/showthread.php?t=9052
This old cowboy, when under the name of Atlantic Web!
Nick

[Simon Hawkins]

Originally Posted by spectre racing

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I accept maybe for Syndney Hobart rib races or fastnet rib races a liferaft might be a comfort but for 99.9% of the ribbing population who likes to burn around the Solent a liferaft is a waste of deckspace and a hazard.

The fact that the defence is coming for a liferaft salesman proves the point.

I have been looking at this thread for some time now and wasnt going to get involved. However I note your comments about the solent. The Solent is Categorised Waters and therefore classified as a safe boating haven, and if you were to have a problem which led to you having to abandon the boat then I am sure the rescue services would get to you before that time came to Jump. However you must appreciate that this forum is not just for people who do their boating in the Solent. If you were crossing channel and you were 30 miles from the english coast and suddenly you had a bad fire on the boat, or you capsized what would you do. You could say well it is a RIB so sit on the hull. How long do you think it would take for hyperthermia to set in, not long, and would you also have all the equipment and supplies to keep you alive and also communicate with the emergency services. This is the reason for having a life raft, but remember that it should only be used as the last resort. I would therefore recommend anybody who is planning on doing any long offshore passages to have a liferaft, not saying you have to buy one as they can be hired at a reasonable price.

[slimtim]

Originally Posted by spectre racing

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I accept maybe for Syndney Hobart rib races or fastnet rib races a liferaft might be a comfort but for 99.9% of the ribbing population who likes to burn around the Solent a liferaft is a waste of deckspace and a hazard.

The fact that the defence is coming for a liferaft salesman proves the point.

So, as rogue wave said, do you put liftrafts on your charter RIBs?

Not sure if you've noticed the tide in the solent, but it flows in such a way that means you could be several miles out in the channel within minutes of an incident occuring. Liferaft or sitting wet and cold on an exposed upturned RIB hull (sitting on a deep vee wouldn't be overly comfortable either )?? I know where i'd rather be in rough, windy cold weather at night.

Tim

[Scary Des]

I think that one issue with a lift raft is that you are very unlikely to use it and as such it is additional weight for little benefit. whereas if you owned an inflatable that could be use as a tender and a liferaft you would have the best of both worlds
A tender on a larger rib would allow you to moor off and go ashore more easily and if it doubled as a life raft even better Tinker tramp made by Henshaws does just that, which is a shame because I was going to patent the idea isn’t it funny how a lot of the best ideas have already been invented
Des